[00:05.280 -> 00:08.600] Wow, good morning and welcome everyone again.
[00:08.600 -> 00:13.760] Joe really doesn't require any introduction from me, but I do want to call out that among
[00:13.760 -> 00:19.700] the many different roles that Joe has, Joe is also a very passionate philanthropist and
[00:19.700 -> 00:23.120] also the proud owner of Brooklyn Nets.
[00:23.120 -> 00:27.560] So Joe, thank you very much for joining us today. Jack Ma
[00:27.560 -> 00:34.340] actually spoke at our very first China Summit back in 2005, and we cannot be more thrilled
[00:34.340 -> 00:41.540] and privileged to have you at our 20th. So before we go to Alibaba, which will be a longer discussion,
[00:42.220 -> 00:46.000] I want to start by asking you, what do you think the next season holds
[00:46.000 -> 00:48.360] for Brooklyn Nets and New York Liberty?
[00:48.640 -> 00:52.780] And whether we can expect a China tour anytime soon?
[00:54.420 -> 00:57.760] Well, first, thank you, Cam Shing, for having me.
[00:57.940 -> 01:00.260] And it's an honor for me to be on the stage.
[01:00.400 -> 01:03.940] And congratulations to your 20th China Global Summit.
[01:05.100 -> 01:07.880] The question about Brooklyn Nets and New York Liberty,
[01:08.060 -> 01:09.440] the first I'll talk about New York Liberty.
[01:09.620 -> 01:11.840] We are starting the season.
[01:12.380 -> 01:14.880] We're four games into the season.
[01:15.040 -> 01:15.700] We're 4-0.
[01:16.220 -> 01:18.300] So that bodes well for the rest of the season.
[01:18.420 -> 01:20.360] That's our women's team in New York.
[01:21.040 -> 01:24.980] The Brooklyn Nets is at a crossroads in a way.
[01:28.820 -> 01:36.540] I think we didn't do as well as we expected last season. We didn't make the playoffs, but we hope to revamp the team and make sure that we can
[01:36.540 -> 01:42.100] compete in the long run. I think there's a difference when people ask owners, what do you
[01:42.100 -> 01:49.980] want to do with a basketball team? There's a difference between I want to win versus I want to build a winning mentality
[01:49.980 -> 01:51.840] and culture that's sustainable.
[01:52.520 -> 01:54.180] Those two are very different things.
[01:54.180 -> 01:59.920] If you want to be just win now, you could ruin your future by trading away all of your
[01:59.920 -> 02:01.780] assets and just win now.
[02:02.180 -> 02:05.180] But I think what I wanted to do with the Brooklyn Nets is to
[02:05.180 -> 02:09.320] take a longer term approach and build a winning, sustainable winning culture.
[02:09.320 -> 02:14.400] Well, the same philosophy, I'm sure, for you for running businesses as well. So can we
[02:14.400 -> 02:18.500] expect a China tour anytime?
[02:18.500 -> 02:28.000] Yeah, I think because of the geopolitical situation right now, it would be very difficult to bring
[02:28.000 -> 02:30.840] the NBA to mainland China.
[02:30.840 -> 02:38.640] But in due course, I hope to see a China tour because what that reflects is a more benign
[02:38.640 -> 02:46.040] geopolitical environment, especially the relationship between the two great powers, United States and China.
[02:46.040 -> 02:48.920] Okay, let's hope that you will be really soon.
[02:48.920 -> 02:52.320] So Joe, you became the chair of Alibaba
[02:52.320 -> 02:53.760] in September last year,
[02:53.760 -> 02:57.080] and since then you've reorganized the management teams
[02:57.080 -> 02:59.680] and made a number of changes.
[02:59.680 -> 03:02.680] Tell us the thinking behind these changes,
[03:02.680 -> 03:04.480] and more specifically,
[03:04.480 -> 03:08.640] how are you gonna invigorate the spirit of growth and innovation,
[03:08.640 -> 03:14.900] which clearly has propelled Alibaba from a marketplace for small Chinese businesses to
[03:14.900 -> 03:22.260] today the multinational tech company that Alibaba is with over a billion dollar of consumers.
[03:22.260 -> 03:25.500] Some critics would say that that spirit might have been somewhat
[03:25.500 -> 03:29.240] lacking in the recent times.
[03:29.240 -> 03:34.000] About a year ago, we announced that we were going to reorganize ourselves.
[03:34.000 -> 03:41.520] The thinking internally, the primary thinking behind that is to ensure that our decision
[03:41.520 -> 03:45.460] making can be faster and that we give autonomy to more the business
[03:45.460 -> 03:51.980] unit CEOs rather than having one group CEO having to make a hundred decisions a day.
[03:51.980 -> 03:52.980] That's not possible.
[03:52.980 -> 04:00.520] So we solved the CEO bandwidth issue by delegating authority to the business units and also to
[04:00.520 -> 04:07.340] younger people. And then we had some personnel changes.
[04:08.100 -> 04:10.440] So I'm in my position where I am now
[04:10.440 -> 04:11.980] because of those personnel changes.
[04:12.540 -> 04:14.780] The great thing is I work with a CEO
[04:14.780 -> 04:17.280] who's much younger than I am.
[04:17.500 -> 04:19.040] He is the day-to-day guy.
[04:19.140 -> 04:20.280] Eddie Wu is our CEO.
[04:20.940 -> 04:24.500] And he has huge credibility within the company
[04:24.500 -> 04:26.540] because he had been a founder of the
[04:26.540 -> 04:27.540] business.
[04:27.540 -> 04:34.820] So we were all in that apartment back in 1999 and he had been involved in developing the
[04:34.820 -> 04:43.560] major platforms like Taobao, Alipay, as well as all the monetization technology for those
[04:43.560 -> 04:45.600] platforms. monetization technology for those platforms, so he's very
[04:46.240 -> 04:48.120] well equipped
[04:48.120 -> 04:52.020] To be the CEO of the company and having that in place
[04:54.100 -> 05:00.300] The next thing we said is we want to have focus and if you look at Alibaba today what we have
[05:00.960 -> 05:05.980] Communicated internally to our employees is that we're in two businesses, e-commerce
[05:05.980 -> 05:06.960] and cloud computing.
[05:07.960 -> 05:13.100] And then there are a lot of businesses that could support, that are strategic to us.
[05:13.640 -> 05:19.040] So to give you an example, we're in the meals delivery business through a platform called
[05:19.040 -> 05:19.360] Elema.
[05:19.820 -> 05:20.380] Oh, yes.
[05:20.520 -> 05:20.660] Yep.
[05:20.860 -> 05:23.340] So do we have to be delivering meals?
[05:23.480 -> 05:24.660] Is that our core business?
[05:26.640 -> 05:27.220] Probably not. However,
[05:36.040 -> 05:41.180] Ulema is totally strategically strategic, important to us because the on-demand delivery infrastructure that it has established, not just to deliver meals, but also other fresh,
[05:41.320 -> 05:46.280] perishable items like medicine, like flowers, fruits, that instant delivery
[05:46.280 -> 05:52.120] infrastructure is completely strategic to us. And that's why it's important part of our business.
[05:52.600 -> 05:59.660] So we've been able to, we went through a process of understanding what is core, what is strategic,
[06:00.120 -> 06:06.000] and what are some of the non-core stuff or financial investments that we can exit over time?
[06:06.940 -> 06:07.940] Right. Great.
[06:08.240 -> 06:14.280] So artificial intelligence is going to be discussed, I think, throughout the summit these couple of days.
[06:14.920 -> 06:19.660] And Alibaba is a very active investor into generative AI.
[06:20.400 -> 06:26.320] And so could you share with us what you think the role AI will play in the world in the coming years?
[06:26.760 -> 06:31.140] And maybe more specifically, how the AI adoption will happen in Alibaba?
[06:31.680 -> 06:36.760] Yeah. Yeah. First, well, for me to sit here and talk about AI is like banmen nongfu.
[06:36.920 -> 06:45.660] You know, like we have a lot of people in the audience who are in actually working on AI projects on a day in and day out basis.
[06:46.840 -> 06:50.380] So the way as a lay person, if you will,
[06:50.380 -> 06:55.200] to understand AI is with today's AI,
[06:55.200 -> 06:58.320] which is very focused on large language models,
[06:58.320 -> 07:02.000] you're basically trying to train a brain
[07:02.000 -> 07:03.860] to achieve machine intelligence
[07:03.860 -> 07:05.720] that could approximate human intelligence.
[07:06.580 -> 07:12.880] And through that training process, that's like educating a child. Let's say you have children
[07:12.880 -> 07:19.080] and you send them to school, you send them to middle school, high school, college, and then
[07:19.080 -> 07:26.960] eventually they get PhDs or eventually they get multiple PhD degrees. This is the race. That's what's going on in the
[07:26.960 -> 07:32.560] large language model race. So when people try to compare large language models and mine is better
[07:32.560 -> 07:38.040] than yours, they're really saying, well, I have a child that has like three PhD degrees and they
[07:38.040 -> 07:46.840] are well versed in biology, math, and psychology, whatever it is, all subject matters.
[07:46.840 -> 07:53.240] The thing is, if you can understand AI and the training of machine intelligence in that
[07:53.240 -> 07:58.360] context, in the context of educating kids.
[07:58.360 -> 08:03.620] So what's happened is it takes about 22 years to send a kid to college and graduate from
[08:03.620 -> 08:06.720] college and maybe they'll pursue postgraduate degrees.
[08:06.720 -> 08:10.340] It took us maybe three or four years
[08:10.340 -> 08:13.480] to get to their large language model
[08:13.480 -> 08:17.140] to be as smart as human beings
[08:18.140 -> 08:19.780] in terms of knowledge
[08:19.780 -> 08:22.960] and certain sort of mathematical computations
[08:22.960 -> 08:24.560] and things like that
[08:24.560 -> 08:26.540] to a point where they're
[08:26.540 -> 08:29.180] just as smart as PhD students.
[08:29.180 -> 08:30.940] And that's pretty scary.
[08:30.940 -> 08:32.580] That's incredible.
[08:32.580 -> 08:35.360] So that's the context.
[08:35.360 -> 08:38.960] Alibaba is involved in AI in three different ways.
[08:38.960 -> 08:46.420] Number one, just fundamentally as a technology company, as a pioneer in technology, we believe in
[08:46.420 -> 08:52.160] continuous advancement of machine intelligence that machines will get smarter and smarter.
[08:52.160 -> 08:59.680] A lot of people talk about artificial general intelligence, this ideal of reaching AGI.
[08:59.680 -> 09:06.240] I'm sure at some point we will have machines that could have some aspect of AGI
[09:06.240 -> 09:08.720] based on however you define AGI.
[09:08.720 -> 09:10.500] Just like, think about a child.
[09:10.500 -> 09:14.340] They could be super, super smart in physics.
[09:15.260 -> 09:16.700] That could be, that's AI.
[09:16.700 -> 09:21.180] But if you ask them to go and make friends,
[09:21.180 -> 09:23.780] make 10 friends in a day, they may not be able to do that.
[09:23.780 -> 09:24.620] Yeah.
[09:24.620 -> 09:26.900] Right? So in certain respects,
[09:27.180 -> 09:33.340] machines can become even smarter than human beings. So we believe in this ideal of AGI
[09:33.340 -> 09:40.700] and continuous development. And today with the idea of scaling law, which means that the more
[09:40.700 -> 09:51.020] resources, whether it's data resources or computing power that you put into it, the marginal return in terms of performance of these large language models does not diminish.
[09:51.020 -> 09:52.020] It continues.
[09:52.020 -> 09:55.440] And in fact, it actually grows in a super linear way.
[09:55.440 -> 10:01.540] That's pretty scary because it just means that the machine can get smarter and smarter
[10:01.540 -> 10:05.420] as long as you feed the machine with data.
[10:05.420 -> 10:12.240] And data is the food and also the books in the library when you're educating a child,
[10:12.240 -> 10:13.240] right?
[10:13.240 -> 10:15.380] You use that analogy.
[10:15.380 -> 10:17.420] So that's number one.
[10:17.420 -> 10:20.540] As a pure ideal, we're going for it.
[10:20.540 -> 10:25.460] And Alibaba has developed our proprietary large language model called Tong Yi Qian Wen,
[10:25.460 -> 10:29.680] which is actually one of the leading models in China. And in certain respects, we are
[10:29.680 -> 10:36.760] competitive globally as well. That's number one. Number two is we have a cloud computing
[10:36.760 -> 10:48.800] business. I think Alibaba is actually probably one of the very few companies that both have proprietary in-house AI capability
[10:48.800 -> 10:50.380] and also a cloud business.
[10:50.380 -> 10:54.520] If you think about it, Microsoft and OpenAI are two separate companies.
[10:54.520 -> 11:00.600] They have a very nice partnership right now, but maybe in the future, they will maybe go
[11:00.600 -> 11:02.060] their separate ways.
[11:02.060 -> 11:06.080] So Microsoft actually does not have their proprietary development of AI.
[11:06.560 -> 11:08.700] They basically outsourced it to open AI.
[11:09.080 -> 11:10.860] Amazon is in the cloud business,
[11:10.860 -> 11:13.080] but they don't have proprietary AI
[11:13.080 -> 11:14.420] that they developed themselves
[11:14.420 -> 11:15.960] in terms of large language model.
[11:16.500 -> 11:18.780] Facebook has their large language model,
[11:18.880 -> 11:20.260] which they open source, Lama,
[11:20.680 -> 11:22.120] but they don't have a cloud business.
[11:22.780 -> 11:24.140] The only American company
[11:24.140 -> 11:25.200] that has sort of both internal, in-house is Google, but Google don't have a cloud business. The only American company that has sort of both
[11:25.200 -> 11:32.380] internal, in-house is Google, but Google is number three in cloud and AI is, you know, some say
[11:32.380 -> 11:37.560] they're not as good as open AI, right? But so you come to China, you look at Alibaba, we're the only
[11:37.560 -> 11:45.200] company that both run a leading cloud business and also we're competitive in AI.
[11:45.200 -> 11:49.500] So that combination between AI and cloud is important.
[11:49.500 -> 11:50.500] Why?
[11:50.500 -> 11:56.360] Because anybody that uses your AI, so we have both open source versions of our AI and also
[11:56.360 -> 12:03.040] our more proprietary version where people can access through APIs.
[12:03.040 -> 12:07.600] Anybody that uses our AI will need to use cloud computing power.
[12:07.760 -> 12:08.540] They need compute.
[12:09.180 -> 12:09.460] All right.
[12:09.580 -> 12:14.940] We also developed the largest open source AI community called Model Scope, which has
[12:14.940 -> 12:18.760] a lot of other people's open source AIs in that marketplace.
[12:19.280 -> 12:23.380] So when they use the open source AI within our community, they need compute.
[12:23.740 -> 12:24.880] So they need computing power.
[12:24.980 -> 12:25.340] That's how we can So they need computing power. That's how
[12:25.340 -> 12:31.580] we can grow our cloud computing revenue. In the last quarter, our AI revenues in the cloud business
[12:31.580 -> 12:37.340] have grown triple digits. So that's very exciting to us, right? So the combination of AI and cloud
[12:37.340 -> 12:45.900] is a terrific combination. So that's the second way. The third way we're involved in AI, and it's important to us,
[12:45.980 -> 12:49.640] is that we can apply AI in numerous vertical applications.
[12:50.260 -> 12:52.940] And if you think about e-commerce, the scenarios in e-commerce
[12:52.940 -> 12:55.040] in terms of recommending what to buy,
[12:55.240 -> 12:58.780] if you want to buy something for your friends,
[12:59.380 -> 13:02.520] you need recommendations for their birthday, let's say.
[13:03.900 -> 13:09.780] And you want to walk into a virtual fitting room to see how some clothing fits
[13:09.780 -> 13:10.220] on you.
[13:10.640 -> 13:12.160] You need personal assistance.
[13:12.420 -> 13:13.540] You need customer service.
[13:13.800 -> 13:18.620] A lot of those things can be drastically enhanced by AI technology.
[13:19.320 -> 13:23.700] And when we look at our use cases in e-commerce, it's incredible.
[13:23.940 -> 13:27.740] We just see so much upside that AI could be applied.
[13:28.360 -> 13:31.120] And so through these ways, we're involved in AI,
[13:31.220 -> 13:32.300] and that's why we're all in.
[13:33.040 -> 13:35.800] Right. I see that you are uniquely positioned
[13:35.800 -> 13:40.220] given that you have both the cloud business and also the AI business.
[13:41.240 -> 13:46.360] AliCloud is probably now the largest platform in Asia Pacific.
[13:46.360 -> 13:48.760] So you're definitely very well positioned there.
[13:48.760 -> 13:52.680] And I love your analogy about AI and raising child.
[13:52.680 -> 13:57.560] Being a mother of two, I know how hard and how long it takes to raise a child.
[13:57.560 -> 14:06.840] But you, aside from your own proprietary large language model, Tong Yi Qian, where you have also made strategic investments
[14:06.840 -> 14:11.080] in five other large language models.
[14:11.080 -> 14:12.380] And do you see synergy there?
[14:12.380 -> 14:14.760] And how are you looking at the progress?
[14:14.760 -> 14:16.120] Sure.
[14:16.120 -> 14:22.220] There's definitely synergies in that, well, first, besides being a parent, we're uncles
[14:22.220 -> 14:27.680] or aunties to five other large language models through which we have relationships.
[14:28.300 -> 14:31.860] When they train their models, they have to use our cloud computing resource.
[14:32.420 -> 14:34.900] And that helps our cloud business.
[14:35.140 -> 14:35.240] Right.
[14:35.520 -> 14:37.820] But it's also a way of hedging our bets.
[14:38.020 -> 14:43.940] We've learned through the last 25 years that, you know, do you go proprietary?
[14:44.340 -> 14:46.100] Do you go open source? Do you invest
[14:46.100 -> 14:52.360] in somebody else? Uh, if you can afford it, a lot of people can't, if you can afford it,
[14:52.360 -> 14:59.160] you do want to hedge the bets. AI is too important of a area where you just go one path.
[14:59.960 -> 15:09.240] Um, I, it reminds me of, uh, Yogi Berra, Yogi Berra saying, uh, he said, when you come to a fork in the road, take it.
[15:12.640 -> 15:18.420] I don't know if people got the joke, but when you come to a fork in the road, take it.
[15:18.800 -> 15:27.440] So I think that's, you know, we want to be well hedged, but having said that, obviously our proprietary large language
[15:27.440 -> 15:31.380] model is very, very important to us and a lot of resources being put into that.
[15:31.380 -> 15:32.380] Okay.
[15:32.380 -> 15:37.640] Well, so maybe let's pivot a little bit and talk about the challenges that Alibaba is
[15:37.640 -> 15:38.640] facing.
[15:38.640 -> 15:39.640] Right?
[15:39.640 -> 15:44.560] Geopolitics clearly is getting more complicated.
[15:44.560 -> 15:48.240] China's economy is still slowing. That's also the
[15:48.240 -> 15:56.880] regulatory scrutiny. And of course, the competition in e-commerce is ever intensifying. How do you
[15:56.880 -> 16:06.980] think about these issues and challenges? That's a great question. You have mentioned regulatory scrutiny, you have mentioned competition,
[16:07.780 -> 16:14.940] geopolitics, Chinese economy. But think about it. Every Chinese technology company faces
[16:14.940 -> 16:20.500] exactly the same issue, right? You know, all those factors. The unfortunate thing is,
[16:20.500 -> 16:25.040] in the last three or four years, those factors, those sort of negative factors
[16:25.040 -> 16:27.260] have become the narrative for Alibaba.
[16:27.860 -> 16:28.940] And it shouldn't be.
[16:29.440 -> 16:30.860] Alibaba is about growth.
[16:31.300 -> 16:33.000] We're about technology innovation.
[16:33.620 -> 16:39.840] We're about applying our technology into our core business to create value for our customers
[16:39.840 -> 16:42.000] and eventually also for our shareholders.
[16:42.000 -> 16:42.820] and eventually also for our shareholders.
[16:50.020 -> 16:50.460] So for us, it is what it is, geopolitics or regulatory, whatever it is.
[16:55.520 -> 16:58.440] We think we're now entering a phase where we're in a stable regulatory environment in the sense that regulation is quite predictable.
[16:58.440 -> 17:03.300] We know what are the red lines, what we can do and cannot do.
[17:04.640 -> 17:05.380] Competition is always, I mean, since day one, we've had competition. the red lines, what we can do and cannot do.
[17:05.380 -> 17:09.060] Competition is always, I mean, since day one, we've had competition.
[17:09.060 -> 17:15.040] So you can't cut costs and cut your way into competition.
[17:15.040 -> 17:18.440] You have to have a growth mindset when you compete.
[17:18.440 -> 17:20.560] And that's where we are.
[17:20.560 -> 17:22.360] That's what we've decided to do.
[17:22.360 -> 17:25.320] We decided to very much focus on our core,
[17:26.760 -> 17:29.440] e-commerce, cloud computing, and our goal over the next 10 years
[17:29.440 -> 17:33.740] is to be able to get back to growth,
[17:34.140 -> 17:35.780] get back to double-digit growth.
[17:35.920 -> 17:38.120] We have said we're sort of,
[17:38.400 -> 17:40.040] from a planning standpoint,
[17:40.400 -> 17:41.760] on a three-year time horizon
[17:41.760 -> 17:47.860] by our fiscal year 2027, March end 2027, we like to be growing
[17:47.860 -> 17:53.880] double digits. Great. I think we are holding our breath. There are many investors or shareholders
[17:53.880 -> 17:59.900] of Alibaba in the room, and I'm sure they are delighted to hear that. So you and Jack co-founded
[17:59.900 -> 18:08.100] Alibaba 25 years ago, and through all the two monumental shifts the past two and a half
[18:08.100 -> 18:14.880] decades, how has your leadership evolved and maybe also vision for Alibaba?
[18:14.880 -> 18:16.760] Yeah.
[18:16.760 -> 18:29.940] Well when I first started at Alibaba 25 years ago, I was a specialist in finance, legal, and I became the CFO of the company. I was CFO
[18:29.940 -> 18:38.980] of the company for 13 years. So my job was very much day-to-day. You had to look after,
[18:39.120 -> 18:48.960] not just look after investors, you have to look at accounting, tax, audit, internal audit, you know, and just making
[18:48.960 -> 18:57.240] sure that we have integrity in our numbers and have a well-established finance department that
[18:57.240 -> 19:10.200] can handle all those things. And it's very much of a day-to-day job. And today, as coming back in as chairman of the company, you know, the job is very different.
[19:11.320 -> 19:17.660] We as a group, management team as a group, including our CEO, are in the doing the work of
[19:17.660 -> 19:28.020] allocating resources and deciding what company resources that we allocate ourselves to. That's not just money, it is also people, right?
[19:28.020 -> 19:34.660] Who to put in which division to run which business.
[19:34.660 -> 19:39.380] Once those decisions have been made, then you do everything, as senior management, you
[19:39.380 -> 19:45.520] do everything to ensure that those resources can be met, the needs can be met.
[19:51.720 -> 19:51.960] That's about making sure that you establish a team of people.
[19:54.460 -> 19:54.740] If you appoint a CEO to a business unit,
[19:58.440 -> 20:00.000] you want to make sure that their direct reports are good people that you help them to recruit.
[20:00.760 -> 20:03.260] You want to establish incentive plans
[20:03.260 -> 20:09.760] so that their personal financial situation can be tied to the performance of the company.
[20:10.940 -> 20:12.520] Designing those plans.
[20:13.160 -> 20:16.180] You want to make sure that they have capital resources.
[20:16.760 -> 20:18.280] So allocation of capital is important.
[20:18.400 -> 20:27.340] So that's the nature of the job today than it was like 15 years ago.
[20:27.340 -> 20:33.400] So much more strategic and providing directions and visions for the company.
[20:33.400 -> 20:38.080] I think that's too grandiose of a way to say.
[20:38.080 -> 20:42.320] I say my job is to get out of people's way.
[20:42.320 -> 20:49.220] Let your CEOs, let your operating management team operate and make day-to-day decisions.
[20:49.220 -> 20:52.540] Because they're on the front line, they're closest to our users, they're closest to our
[20:52.540 -> 20:57.880] customers, they should be in the primary position to make those decisions rather than me.
[20:57.880 -> 21:05.980] Okay, fantastic. So maybe I would, you alluded to it, but there are probably many shareholders
[21:05.980 -> 21:07.500] of Alibaba in the room
[21:07.500 -> 21:11.460] and potential shareholders of Alibaba in the room.
[21:11.920 -> 21:15.280] What would you, what can they expect of the company
[21:15.280 -> 21:18.740] in the next one, three, five years?
[21:21.920 -> 21:30.240] So they, I think the first thing our shareholders should expect is that management has extreme
[21:30.240 -> 21:31.240] focus.
[21:31.240 -> 21:36.400] We're extremely focused on our core businesses and how to create value and how to serve our
[21:36.400 -> 21:39.300] customers, right?
[21:39.300 -> 21:43.360] To give you an example, strategically, we have decided in our e-commerce business that
[21:43.360 -> 21:50.080] we always put users first. Alibaba has always struggled in terms of trying to define who our
[21:50.080 -> 21:55.100] customers are. Is it the merchants that are selling or are they the users that
[21:55.100 -> 21:59.820] are actually purchasing your products? We have decidedly gone into users first.
[21:59.820 -> 22:05.320] That's because they're actually eventually spending the money to benefit our merchants.
[22:06.040 -> 22:18.060] They're actually converting it to use our internal language, converting into purchases that will create business volume for us.
[22:18.500 -> 22:19.740] So users first.
[22:20.580 -> 22:31.600] So having that extreme focus and having a very clear strategic direction of what's important and what's not, that's what our shareholders should expect from management.
[22:32.380 -> 22:37.500] And we're not going to spend time on unimportant things.
[22:37.800 -> 22:44.620] I mean, there are a lot of businesses within our portfolio right now that, to be honest, are not that important.
[22:45.260 -> 22:48.540] So that's not going to occupy a ton of mindshare.
[22:48.540 -> 22:54.360] The only mindshare that we will apply to that is we'll figure out ways to exit those businesses.
[22:54.360 -> 23:02.160] So we can expect continued divestment of some of these non-core businesses from the company?
[23:02.160 -> 23:03.160] Yeah.
[23:03.160 -> 23:07.620] As you know, we've said in the last quarter, we've sold down non-core financial assets,
[23:07.620 -> 23:13.080] and we declared a special dividend from the proceeds of those sales.
[23:14.000 -> 23:19.620] I think people should expect that that's an ongoing project, and we have established
[23:20.340 -> 23:25.840] special teams to manage that because we don't want that to distract our operating
[23:25.840 -> 23:34.960] management team. Fantastic. So we started the conversation about sports. I'd like to end
[23:34.960 -> 23:40.920] our discussion today by asking you a question. How did you keep yourself in this tip-top condition?
[23:40.920 -> 23:45.920] Do you join your team and play basketball or what do you do to keep yourself
[23:47.200 -> 23:55.600] fit? 25 years you seem to look pretty much the same. Thank you. People think when you own an
[23:55.600 -> 23:59.520] NBA team you can actually go on the court and play with your players. That's not true.
[24:00.480 -> 24:10.900] No, I thought that was the privilege of the owner. This is a privilege, but they would be just to try to, you know, they will reluctantly go through that.
[24:11.280 -> 24:13.120] No, I can't force them to play with me.
[24:13.400 -> 24:16.880] Now, I can't even force my kids to play basketball with me.
[24:16.940 -> 24:19.920] I have two sons who both played high school basketball.
[24:20.860 -> 24:23.080] One is 21, the other one is 17.
[24:23.520 -> 24:24.640] They have now refused.
[24:27.820 -> 24:29.420] I have gotten to a point where they refuse to play me because I'm not good enough.
[24:29.420 -> 24:35.880] So to your question, I think it's very important to stay disciplined when it comes to just
[24:35.880 -> 24:44.180] exercise, watch what you eat, and have a regular life.
[24:44.180 -> 24:50.800] The challenge for me is I travel quite a bit. So the jet lag does get to you.
[24:52.480 -> 24:58.800] I used to prioritize exercise over sleep. So for example, you arrive at six o'clock in the morning,
[25:00.000 -> 25:05.040] you know, you go to the gym, right? Now I prioritize sleep over exercise.
[25:05.880 -> 25:08.480] There's a book that I would recommend everybody to read.
[25:08.740 -> 25:10.300] It's called Why You Sleep.
[25:11.000 -> 25:14.140] Basically, what it says is that 99% of the people in the world
[25:14.140 -> 25:16.840] need at least seven to eight hours of sleep.
[25:17.260 -> 25:20.060] And if you think you're that 1%, you're not.
[25:22.680 -> 25:24.840] I am the 99%.
[25:24.840 -> 25:25.000] Yeah, I used to, you know, for example, I am the 99%.
[25:25.000 -> 25:26.000] Yeah.
[25:26.000 -> 25:31.360] I used to, for example, during a phase in the time, I still remember six months before
[25:31.360 -> 25:37.460] our IPO in 2014, I slept three or four hours a day for six months.
[25:37.460 -> 25:42.380] And that's not the way to live.
[25:42.380 -> 25:45.880] You're going to crash yourself if you don't get enough sleep.
[25:45.880 -> 25:46.880] Okay.
[25:46.880 -> 25:49.240] Six to seven hours of sleep every day.
[25:49.240 -> 25:50.240] No, seven to eight.
[25:50.240 -> 25:51.240] Seven to eight.
[25:51.240 -> 25:52.240] Okay.
[25:52.240 -> 25:57.280] And when you sleep, we talked about this in the green room, when you sleep, keep your
[25:57.280 -> 25:58.280] temperature low.
[25:58.280 -> 25:59.280] Yeah.
[25:59.280 -> 26:00.280] Yes.
[26:00.280 -> 26:01.280] Preserve yourself better.
[26:01.280 -> 26:03.280] Preserve yourself better.
[26:03.280 -> 26:04.280] Yeah.
[26:04.280 -> 26:06.040] I feel very cold on this stage.
[26:06.040 -> 26:08.040] It's good.
[26:08.040 -> 26:09.040] In the right condition.
[26:09.040 -> 26:12.280] So ladies and gentlemen, if you can join me and thank Joe.
[26:12.280 -> 26:13.280] Thank you.
[26:13.280 -> None] Thank you.
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